As the circus show is coming to a sheepish end in Chennai, long-term retreat attendees will be heading home with a bad taste in their mouths. The loathsome exalting of Daniel clan (rather partial Daniel clan) made it more than clear that the villainous plans of LD have succeeded in making her dreams come true; the dreams of making JJD the one and only "crowned prince of LEF" with absolutely no opposition from any Daniel family members of either JD's generation or Daniel family members of JJD's generation. The two Daniel family members are Lydia Daniel and Caleb Daniel. Lydia Daniel, the youngest daughter is made the business partner as she is not likely to have any inheritance of her own and does not have the charisma to take over the reins from JJD and thus will not pose any threat to JJD's throne. The one other Daniel clan residue still left in LEF is the one on the keyboard who has resigned himself to be the least in the pecking order. He seems to be quite content to be in the pits so as to say as long as the pit is still part of the "glorified pulpit." Now how did LD achieve all this? This is not an overnight thing but result of her hard work in scheming and manipulating for over two decades. In the politics LD played to secure her son's place on the throne, LEF people (including evangelists) were reduced to mere pawns and puppets.
LD, who was not a major contributor to the growth of LEF was rightfully restricted to be just the wife of JD as long as Mrs. Devanamma Daniel and Mrs. Kamala Paul were at the helm of LEF affairs. There are numerous first hand accounts of people who were close to JD's family that LD was more of a liability than an asset to JD in the expansion of LEF. There is also a huge consensus in LEF old-timers that JD moved his family to US to avoid the embarrassment caused by LD's fights with JD's family members. So, Daniel family has its own share of mother-in-law Vs daughter-in-law politics along with sister-in-law rivalry. LD, who always aspired to be the whole and sole of LEF waited like a hawk to scoop away LEF to make it her very own. JD's sickness provided a great opportunity to LD to completely manipulate and control JD, who was otherwise hard to manipulate. JD, who successfully kept LD out of LEF affairs for a very long time, couldn't shut her out once his health took a toll. LD slyly sold the dream of making JJD the apparent heir of LEF to JD quite well and JD, who did not see LD as his partner in LEF affairs, slowly let her in to take control of LEF affairs. JJD was the obvious choice of LD as he was and is the little mama's boy who will always toe the line that LD sets. All in the name of avoiding stressful encounters, LD made sure that JD was completely isolated from the actual happenings in LEF. Meanwhile, Mrs. KP and her cohorts saw that the ground under them was shifting and dreaded the thought of JJD succeeding to the throne. KP's desperation to block out JJD from becoming LEF head made her to do some extreme things. As unfortunate as it is, KP tried to make her niece's husband who is now in Germany the LEF head and to this effect she tried to chang the constitution of LEF board. LD who by then had cultivated her own stooges in Madras had this information of KP trying to change the board just in time for JD to come and take over. JD with her beloved son JJD landed in India on war footing and completely dissolved the board and kicked KP and her cohorts out. This change put LEF on golden platter and handed it over to LD. Now the villainess LD started her draconian rule in LEF. LD's pets and stooges were appointed as key players in LEF. IC the chief stooge was unanimously appointed as the Finance member of LEF. JD who by then had become a mere puppet in the hands of LD did not even heed to the pleadings of his old mother to reconsider his decision of replacing KP with IC. Systematically, LD placed her people in key places. People who were sympathetic to KP were either sidelined or driven out. Then came the era of corruption and bribes in LEF. Manipulation and coercion became just a way of life in LEF. IC became the power house LEF as he now not only had the full blessings of LD but also became the think-tank of LEF. IC became the confidant to JD and LD and he along with his wicked cohorts ensured that JD was completely kept in dark about all the evil happenings in LEF. For the last 15 years or so, JD was just a rubber stamp. Letters and emails were all forged. Signatures on crucial documents were forged. Thanks to LD - she successfully degraded LEF operations to the operations of a brothel house. Whatever helped in the broad scheme of crowning JJD as the prince of LEF was the one that took precedence over any welfare of people. JJD and junior LD were the two dull heads to whom LD sold the dream of becoming price and princess of LEF kingdom. The oldest daughter who was always at logger heads with the mother did not succeed in breaking the unholy relationship of LD with IC. Since Betty and James cried foul to IC's involvement in both family and LEF matters, both of them were shut out from the family. Clearly LD chose IC over her own children. KP who played a major role in LEF operations did what all she could to get back at LD. One of KP's major achievements was ensuring that JD was shut out of Germany and also to some extent out of Canada. Eventually KP resigned to her fate and maintained a low key and was made to stay from LEF operations. While LD did not see any major threat to her beloved son JJD from KP and her cohorts, she was ill-advised by IC that the threat to JJD was her own daughter Betty. LD knows that Betty, who is any day more talented the pigeon head will be a threat to her son's throne. As lucky as LD is, the opportunity presented to her just in time to seal the fate of Betty in LEF months before the death of JD. The letter that we published on our last post was the last nail in the coffin of Betty's fate in LEF. While there is a lot of speculation of whether or not JD actually wrote that letter, the letter was the best trump card LD and IC played against Betty. Now Betty unlike KP is not willing to resign to her fate but is actively promoting herself as the true legacy of her charismatic dad. So, now the Daniel family drama has become a soap opera for the whole world to watch.
After all the trouble LD had gone through to make JJD the king to the throne, Betty in her TV show has out performed her pigeon head brother and JJD is paling off in comparison to her dynamic big sister. We need to see what's the next card LD will play. Is there any other mom out there in the wide world who will so shamelessly pitch her own children against each other? If this woman can hurt her own flesh and blood so badly, it is anybody's guess as to how cruelly she would have hurt others in LEF.
LD, who was not a major contributor to the growth of LEF was rightfully restricted to be just the wife of JD as long as Mrs. Devanamma Daniel and Mrs. Kamala Paul were at the helm of LEF affairs. There are numerous first hand accounts of people who were close to JD's family that LD was more of a liability than an asset to JD in the expansion of LEF. There is also a huge consensus in LEF old-timers that JD moved his family to US to avoid the embarrassment caused by LD's fights with JD's family members. So, Daniel family has its own share of mother-in-law Vs daughter-in-law politics along with sister-in-law rivalry. LD, who always aspired to be the whole and sole of LEF waited like a hawk to scoop away LEF to make it her very own. JD's sickness provided a great opportunity to LD to completely manipulate and control JD, who was otherwise hard to manipulate. JD, who successfully kept LD out of LEF affairs for a very long time, couldn't shut her out once his health took a toll. LD slyly sold the dream of making JJD the apparent heir of LEF to JD quite well and JD, who did not see LD as his partner in LEF affairs, slowly let her in to take control of LEF affairs. JJD was the obvious choice of LD as he was and is the little mama's boy who will always toe the line that LD sets. All in the name of avoiding stressful encounters, LD made sure that JD was completely isolated from the actual happenings in LEF. Meanwhile, Mrs. KP and her cohorts saw that the ground under them was shifting and dreaded the thought of JJD succeeding to the throne. KP's desperation to block out JJD from becoming LEF head made her to do some extreme things. As unfortunate as it is, KP tried to make her niece's husband who is now in Germany the LEF head and to this effect she tried to chang the constitution of LEF board. LD who by then had cultivated her own stooges in Madras had this information of KP trying to change the board just in time for JD to come and take over. JD with her beloved son JJD landed in India on war footing and completely dissolved the board and kicked KP and her cohorts out. This change put LEF on golden platter and handed it over to LD. Now the villainess LD started her draconian rule in LEF. LD's pets and stooges were appointed as key players in LEF. IC the chief stooge was unanimously appointed as the Finance member of LEF. JD who by then had become a mere puppet in the hands of LD did not even heed to the pleadings of his old mother to reconsider his decision of replacing KP with IC. Systematically, LD placed her people in key places. People who were sympathetic to KP were either sidelined or driven out. Then came the era of corruption and bribes in LEF. Manipulation and coercion became just a way of life in LEF. IC became the power house LEF as he now not only had the full blessings of LD but also became the think-tank of LEF. IC became the confidant to JD and LD and he along with his wicked cohorts ensured that JD was completely kept in dark about all the evil happenings in LEF. For the last 15 years or so, JD was just a rubber stamp. Letters and emails were all forged. Signatures on crucial documents were forged. Thanks to LD - she successfully degraded LEF operations to the operations of a brothel house. Whatever helped in the broad scheme of crowning JJD as the prince of LEF was the one that took precedence over any welfare of people. JJD and junior LD were the two dull heads to whom LD sold the dream of becoming price and princess of LEF kingdom. The oldest daughter who was always at logger heads with the mother did not succeed in breaking the unholy relationship of LD with IC. Since Betty and James cried foul to IC's involvement in both family and LEF matters, both of them were shut out from the family. Clearly LD chose IC over her own children. KP who played a major role in LEF operations did what all she could to get back at LD. One of KP's major achievements was ensuring that JD was shut out of Germany and also to some extent out of Canada. Eventually KP resigned to her fate and maintained a low key and was made to stay from LEF operations. While LD did not see any major threat to her beloved son JJD from KP and her cohorts, she was ill-advised by IC that the threat to JJD was her own daughter Betty. LD knows that Betty, who is any day more talented the pigeon head will be a threat to her son's throne. As lucky as LD is, the opportunity presented to her just in time to seal the fate of Betty in LEF months before the death of JD. The letter that we published on our last post was the last nail in the coffin of Betty's fate in LEF. While there is a lot of speculation of whether or not JD actually wrote that letter, the letter was the best trump card LD and IC played against Betty. Now Betty unlike KP is not willing to resign to her fate but is actively promoting herself as the true legacy of her charismatic dad. So, now the Daniel family drama has become a soap opera for the whole world to watch.
After all the trouble LD had gone through to make JJD the king to the throne, Betty in her TV show has out performed her pigeon head brother and JJD is paling off in comparison to her dynamic big sister. We need to see what's the next card LD will play. Is there any other mom out there in the wide world who will so shamelessly pitch her own children against each other? If this woman can hurt her own flesh and blood so badly, it is anybody's guess as to how cruelly she would have hurt others in LEF.
Can someone say what has happened to Kamala Paul and Whitson Paul? I knew both of them personally (as well as Mrs. N. Daniel). While I disagree with some of their theology, they were sincere people. I heard that they had been marginalized. I'd be interested to hear about them.
ReplyDeleteYou are mistaken, all that Calu baby and his mother Peace Daniel want are Viceroy Status in Bangalore. PHD doesn’t still understand how much money is generated as offerings from Bangalore and eaten by Peace Daniels. The day he understands different things will happen, Callu baby will act as a pit boy in madras, see him roaring in action in Bangalore. Calu baby acts so that the whole family benefits from the offerings from Bangalore. One question to JJD, Callu baby is introduced as Evangelist HQ then who is the Evangelist Bangalore
ReplyDeleteIC was brought to send money by Hawala Channels, which KP would never have done (she would not even know) this money was required by LD for her family, so IC became greater, like 50:50 (for him and LD)
As known from available documents, the LEF did not have JD / LD / JJD as members in the original trust, they were, WP/KP, Mrs.Daniel, Francis Daniel. WP/KP wanted to bequeath their LEF shares to the daughter of KP’s sister. JD, JJD and LD were thinking that WP/KP will give to JJD (as WP/KP didn’t have biological children), as this didn’t happen, this irritated JD LD and JJD who came and used their muscle power as Hitler and got some people to sign on blank paper and wrote to the Government that LEF was dead as a dodo and informed the start of a new trust LEFI with JJD, JD, LD and Francis Daniel (who sat on the wall but took a clear decision when he saw the things happening). This new trust as I know has not yet been registered. No foreign citizen an be the head of an Indian trust so what presently happening in LEF is plain dacoity
The oldest daughter took the idea of “first born gets all”, a little too far… (her brother said first son is the best son) and wanted all the money for herself and decided to kick out IC, who clawed back, and finally a financial settlement was agreed. The real reason is that both Lizard and JJD have seen the wealth of LEF which by one neutral observer is in the range of US $ 3-5 billion and so all the fights. The children of JD were given enough gifts / perks/ foreign jaunts. Only they were not allowed to be the boss.
This letter was probably not written by JD as the style is markedly different, also similar cases of signature fraud were known in the LEF, but the letter was used by JJD to kick out the lizard.
No, she feels that the son will be under her thumb and she will be the defacto Mother Daniel II
Can someone say what has happened to Kamala Paul and Whitson Paul?
JD, JJD, LD, IC and team waited for many years for old WP to die soon, so that they can conduct his burial in a grand manner and even announce that at his death he had blessed JJD, but the good Lord in his infinite wisdom has extended the life of WP and KP. Who thought that he would be alive to conduct he burial service of JD (surely not JD) as the LEF has kicked out / made life unliveable KP/WP in the \HQ, they are living in a small flat in the outskirts of Madras. Like the ancient kings, in the LEF the winner will take all, I hope that Dr.WP with his extensive scholarship, at least by now would have understood the monsters in LEF (he also played a role in their creation)
Even Sonia G failed to do this trick in making her son RG PM of India in last voting..!!?
ReplyDeleteInteresting politics SG should learn at least for next time from these people
Shame to see these politics in a Christian organization
You are soo right. Even hindus folow rules and laws. Poor SG dont have ministry to hide behind. She is accountable to the tax payers.
DeleteAnonymousMay 24, 2015 11:10 PM
ReplyDeleteI completely am with you on the politics that are played at the Bangalore Center so much that my insides want out. It smells rotten and like me the whole lot wish change.
But stop broadcasting some nonsensical views without any ground. I've been around for the last couple of decades and been integral towards the operations and I can for one vouch that there is no hanky panky on the offerings. It goes straight out to the HQ. I know how meticulous they've been with the handling of the offerings. Let me ask you what’s your ground to put out a statement that they have been misusing funds? Have you been witness to any? You say PHD doesn't know how much money like you know how much money is generated and all it's applications?
Moreover this aspect of tithing and offerings has been discussed here before. My view is we as Christians give to God and honor Him when we give. So it's absolutely unethical on Biblical grounds to hold the church accountable to what it is that they do with the offerings. A better way to put this in perspective is to give where you're fed the word of God. If you're fed at a different place by a different person than go ahead and tithe there. But it's completely against Biblical Principles for us Christians to dissect what the church does with the offerings. Like I said if God leads you to give elsewhere than that should be right thing to do instead of causing strife over what the church does with the offerings. To come to think of it in a way we are questioning God and wanting control over how the Church spends what God has entitled them to. If they are at wrong they would receive what they sow to cause that's what the Bible teaches us.
Straight out of the Bible - Hebrews 13:17 - it’s just going to be unprofitable to us if we rebel usurp and rebel against them. Instead a better way would be to call it quits and look for a different church where we are fed and are convinced of the place to be a meeting of believers alike.
P.S – if somehow you’re drawn to think that I’m one among them you’d be very wrong and sorry, because if I were to tell my name then you’d know that I was the foremost REBEL at the Bangalore center questioning every happening, so much that so to speak caused an uproar. So peace out!
Anonymous 11.10pm
DeleteYou are wrong about the church not having to be accountable for what happens to the offerings. However the LEF is not a true church in the New Testament sense; it is not properly governed by consent of a membership since it has no established and recorded membership, who would normally vote on what should be done with income and who the leadership should be. If you look into the New Testament you will see that the apostles encouraged local, self-governing churches to be set up and governed locally by local leaders. This is evident later when, for example, the apostle Paul thanks particular churches for gifts which, by consent of the membership, they had sent to him and others. The fact that he takes time to thank them indicates that he did not automatically expect to live off their offerings, and we know that in fact he worked as a tent-maker in order to support himself, at least for part of his ministry. Whatever does or does not happen to the tithes and offerings in Hyderabad or anywhere else, it is doubtful that they are properly administered in a New Testament fashion. It is clear from what has been written here that no accounts are made available for the givers to peruse if they wish, and no opportunity is available for them to help decide what their local group should be doing with the income. One thing is certain, and that is that it should not be used to support any person or persons without majority consent being sought from every recorded member - except that there is no recorded membership! If the offerings are sent to HQ, that is quite unbiblical, even if individuals have not tampered with them in advance. They should be counted and banked in the name of the local church by trustworthy individuals nominated by the local membership. Such counting should be done and checked by two people at least. If local tithes and offerings are being used to support persons who should be supporting themselves, and without the consent of the givers, that is equally unbiblical. LEF attenders have been brainwashed for decades by Joshua Daniel and others into thinking that any kind of accountability is spiritually wrong. I cannot say for sure what his motives were since I did not ask him that specific question, but I did tell him, via his wife, that transparent financial accountability is required in any Christian group, and that he was no exception. This is a responsibility given by God to the local church, managed via regular church membership meetings organised by the elected leadership.
You are right to encourage people to start again with a trustworthy, biblically led local Christian church where they will be properly edified, and will be able to play their rightful part through the essential responsibility of membership. However if they do, and I hope you do too, they will find that financial matters will be carefully recorded, monitored, and decided by the membership. The LEF cannot be resurrected as a real Christian entity, since it has never been conducted on a biblical basis. As my father used to say, 'You cannot make a silk purse out of a sows ear'!
Yes the church ( I mean the leaders) are definitely accountable to its members as to what they do with the tithes and offerings. This rule is followed by organized churches in India as well. For example CSI/CNI, Methodist churches have a rule book and they have a procedure in practice for collection / counting, depositing the offerings in proper bank accounts and there is an element of transprency. Even one step further, any member of a church can verify the details relating to the original documents of the property owned by the church, For example if a member of a church wants to find out in whose names a property belonging to the church are registered , he//she can do so after payment of a prescribed fee. Inspite of this frauds do happen. But we can not say there are no rules. But I really wonder how LEF, grown so big (in terms of the volume of property owned) has no transparency .... Really sad .... Both the leaders and the followers are to be blamed for the present state of affairs. I am just reminded of .one Thirukural which we learnt in school , when translated (by me!) goes like...When a King has no advisers who can criticize, him,, the kingdom will fall on its own even when there are no enemies to destruct meaning self destruction..
DeleteCSI/CNI, Methodist churches have a rule book, the LEF has only one rule, All for Daniels, but the LEF calls the other churches as dead churches,The LEF is not a church, it is a non-transparent family business trust (also known as Blade company, which will cut any and all) benefiting one family (this will answer the question of accountability)
DeleteHello Whistle Blowers,
ReplyDeleteI have been reading this for some time now and I have noticed a trend with the blog that is taking it downhill.
Please try to take the high moral ground.
There is no need to resort to name calling. The bible tells us that to call someone a fool puts us in risk of hell. So how much better are word like, lizard, pigeon head, villainess stooge, thugs, etc.
I understand your anger but “be angry and sin not”. I was very mad too, but that took me nowhere I wanted to go spiritually.
I understand that the whistle blowers are providing a platform where people with a lot of pent up grievances can air their frustration. I think that is good and healthy if done correctly. It gives a voice to the voiceless and empowers the powerless.
Do you think that God does not know what people have been up to inside. I certainly know and I came out a long time back.
Another thing you should know. KP WP are suffering and perhaps unjustly. But they had also caused the suffering of many. They also set the downfall of many innocent people. I personally witnessed the duplicity in their life and distanced myself from them, and with any of these leaders who profess God with their lips but their hearts were far from him.
None of these people who were involved at the top of the LEF pyramid scheme, are innocent. Their hands are all stained black with extortion money, or with power madness. I have watched as people were made to kneel in the presence of KP for prayer. I do not know why anyone would kneel to anyone but Jesus. Thousands of people died in Japan who refused to bow, or kiss the emperor’s ring. Because they worshiped Jesus not the emperor. So why do people perform acts of veneration that are way more than signs of respect, to any of their fellowship leaders. When I was attending the bible school if someone got on their knees for prayer before me, I also got on my knees along with them.
My point is this. Wait long enough and you will see the Lord will act. “Vengeance is mine I will repay”. Payback is hell – or can be, quite literally.
Brothers and sisters do not let the injustices of unrighteous people rob you of your joy and love for the Lord.
Remember the greatest commandment Love God with all your heart soul mind strength and your neighbor as yourself.
Let the Pharisees inside LEF pass by the wounded, on the far side of the road, it does not matter what they do, they will have their reward in due time.
Rather you all bind up the wounds of the wounded, with oil and wine and take care of them till they heal. Ripping open the wounds again and again is not going to help them.
Some good advice, Anonymous 26 May 5.39am. However I think the term 'thug' is justified, since it describes one who is guilty of certain violent and other negative behaviour, for which there seems to be plenty of evidence amongst the LEF leadership. Even two of Joshua Daniel's own children have publicly condemned the LEF as a 'goonda' fellowship, one with commendable frankness and courage at his father's memorial service, the other with apparently less noble motives, as part of a power struggle with her mother, brother, and sister, a ploy now, apparently, discarded in favour of setting up a 'rival' TV broadcast (did anyone notice that she has used pics of Beulah Gardens events as an illustration for her 'ministry', even though she has evidently been barred from taking any part in those meetings?).
DeleteJust a couple of thoughts: Jesus Himself used very strong language in public about the Pharisees - 'whited sepulchres', meaning 'full of rot inside', 'putrescent'. However I agree that personal insults based on individual physical appearance (which no-one can help) are counterproductive. As you have illustrated in your comment about Kamala Paul, delusions of grandeur requiring obsequious behaviour seem to go hand-in-hand with being a member of the Daniel family. Mockery is perhaps one way of helping to dispel such delusions, especially in the minds of those who have hitherto believed that the Daniels are entitled to the exaggerated reverence they receive and expect. Mockery can contribute to the disempowering of such fraudulent folk, of helping others to realise that there is nothing 'special' or 'anointed' (a gross misuse of the Biblical term) about them. We find examples of such mockery in Scripture, even. Did not Moses mock Pharaoh's magicians? It would seem that it cannot be just a question of people who have realised the truth about LEF leaving, and standing back to wait for God's justice. Obviously many have left already. However I think that many of them are anxious about family and friends who are still caught up in the cultish organisation that is LEF, or are likely to be because they are growing up in LEF families. In the New Testament we see many examples of 'hirelings' being publicly exposed and ejected, and we are encouraged to do likewise for the sake of the Gospel and the true believers in the flock. It is not merely a question of giving vent to anger. Therefore I do not think your advice to be passive is entirely correct. There is a happy medium, expressed in your advice that we should be careful not to sin ourselves in the process of confronting evil.
lizard (because one women married for the 3rd time (some calculations put it at 8) and changed her name to Liz, which rhymed with lizard
Deletepigeon head, It is the term JJD used to describe telugu people in USA (fits him perfectly)
villainess means (in a film, novel, or play) a female character whose evil actions or motives are important to the plot
stooge, means a subordinate used by another to do unpleasant routine work.
thugs means a cruel or vicious ruffian, or robber
Goonda is a term in Indian English, Pakistani English, and Bangladeshi English for a hired thug
I think the terms fit perfectly
she has used pics of Beulah Gardens events as an illustration for her 'ministry', even though she has evidently been barred from taking any part in those meetings?
Deletethis means some body passed her the pictures, OK but why the LEF board has taken no action, it is a serious infringement of copyright, It means that the in the Daniel family JJD and lizard are 2 sides of the same coin, all the fighting is just a show
In fairness, they were probably old pictures of previous retreats, and it is not actually stated that she routinely 'preaches' there. She could simply have copied them from the LEF website. However it is a form of deception, since those pictures imply that she 'preaches' to large congregations, and have nothing to do with whatever she thinks she is doing on this Telegu TV programme; pictures of the small 'village church' of which she claims to be 'co-pastor' would have been more honest.
DeleteAnonymous 29 May @ 9.22pm
DeleteYou have satisfactorily explained most of the descriptive terms, although I am not too sure about the use of 'lizard', and possibly 'pigeon head'. I had not realised that John Daniel called the Telegu people 'pigeon heads'. What did he mean by this? How does this description fit him (though I am sure that it was meant to be rude when he used it about Telegu people....but isn't one of his parents a Telegu person?)? Probably best not to use what seem to be insults unless they actually describe what someone is because of their actions or demeanour - such as 'thug'.
I think we are going overboard with allegations on the Bangalore center. Lets not resort to unfounded allegations which show nothing but a lot of maliciousness.
ReplyDeleteTo -- AnonymousMay 27, 2015 3:43 AM
ReplyDeleteWhat is going over board.. which of this is not true..
1.Buying land near the army camp - got duped and still covering up.
2.Not having a permanent evangelist for so many years.
3. Sidelining many evangelist and making them puppets.
4.why dose different evangelists from other centers have to travel every week. I personally know some evangelists themselves who are not happy handling 2 services back to back and also about the long travel they have to undertake.
5.Why is that the old lady want to get the all importance.
6.Obviously she afraid if there be any evangelist set up permanently, people will not give importance to her and she cannot establish her dynasty there.
7. why are people sidelined and not allowed to participate actively as before for the simple reason of marrying outside lef?
and many more ... list is endless
Are you trying to establish a dictorship. Should anyone not question?
Even Kim Jong of N Korea seems better.
AnonymousMay 27, 2015 10:15 AM
ReplyDeleteI am referring to the allegation that the collections are being stolen in Bangalore and that nobody knows what the exact collection amount is without any evidence whatsoever. I am seeing a trend here....easiest way to get rid of people in lef who you dont like is to make allegations of financial irregularities. It looks like everyone got wind of the fact that HQ is paranoid about such allegations because on one hand they dont want anyone to steal and on the other hand they dont like any accountability/transparency either as they want to make sure they are not caught. So, who is to blame for the fact that no one knows what the exact collection is in Bangalore? The Chennai guys who dont want any accountability or Bangalore folks who are following a set of rules???
What I am observing here is - people having different opinions and having their own set of "dos" and "don'ts"! Finding a common ground here is very difficult. What is O.K. to someone may not be the same to another one!
DeleteHeard there were huge investments on lands in many places all over India by LEF and were not yet been started construction
ReplyDeleteCan anyone come up with the list of lands purchased by LEF and were on hold by local govt not to construct church..!! "stuck up investments by over estimations without ground work"
The LEF structure always gives trouble when permission are required from the Government. In the LEF there is a perennial and eternal hatred to committees as the JD clan never wanted to yield its tight control. In a normal organization, there would be Regional Offices headed by competent staff who will follow up, but in LEF everything will be centralized. There would be no regional offices, so it will look like the Madras office is building, The rules may prevent it, The officers will want a local office address So all files will wait for JD to come (from color of the tile to color of the wall). Then the LEF will not accept that it is a church but will slyly call the construction as Youth Centre (meaning it is not a church) which is also true as the LEF has neither a constitution nor a list of members. As I know in Delhi, Mumbai and Bangalore constructions have been planned but have not yet started, The LEF needs competent engineers who will plan the operations before they even buy the land,(there are exceptional people, but they are not allowed) a lot of problems are due to zoning regulations, land size, approach roads. Everybody else will think, plan and proceed, but in LEF JD will say by faith the Red Sea opened and all will be OK. Such an approach has brought good grief to many a plan (Ok to be fair some plans escaped). One latest joke is this, 3 interconnected houses were planned to be built and the Prayer center was planned to be built over that, but the rule prevented multiple house building (for whom the 3 houses were planned to be built, I leave to your imagination), then what about car parking, so the whole file was just abandoned, If you have no building / structure so what. the LEF congregation is ready to sit in sun and rain and offering is not going to be reduced due to lack of facilities so why the bother, less expenditure means more profits
DeleteTo Anonymous, 27 May, 1.08pm
ReplyDeleteThe common ground is that LEF is an unhealthy and cultish organisation unbiblically dominated by an untrustworthy group of people from the same family. The evidence for this, and for the resultant abuse which is happening, has been confirmed in many ways over a long period of time by many people from many places (including the North America and Europe), and can be found a) on this site and on the 'Suniemi' website b) through an understanding of the biblical doctrine of the church ('ecclesiology').
Minor quibbles about what may have happened, or be happening, in any one place do not alter the reality of the above situation. People's personal views on what constitutes a genuine church, and how a true church should be governed, must be soundly Bible-based to be valid. It must be born in mind that people who have known nothing else but the defective ministry of the LEF will not usually be familiar with Biblical church government. It must also be born in mind that some who have some kind of vested interest in protecting LEF are posting here, and their posts will necessarily conflict with the views of the majority.
The meaning of maliciousness is having or showing a desire to cause harm to someone: given to, marked by, or arising from malice, but I can truly say that not even 1% of the happenings at Bangalore have been reported here.
ReplyDeleteDo you know/anybody know the exact collection? OK why the secrecy? If the LEF stalwarts have nothing to hide why don’t they accept a transparent modern system on online offering management, where the treasurer (who is identified and known) along with 2 Asst treasurers collect , count and deposit the offerings in the nearest bank and spend money form the account by a system of cheques signed by 3 signatures. Why the very strange practice of collecting all the offering money in a bag, taking it home and them maintain accounts which are perfect (as I say, after skimming of the cream). I really pity the Aiyagarus who take 6 offering bags to a room for a special prayer and bring out 4, they need to undergo training with such real pros. Why say my grandfather never had a system, if so, he never went abroad, then why do you all live abroad?
OK do you have money to take pleasure trips to Singapore, Thailand, Malaysia and USA (on ministry of course)? Can the distinguished 3rd gen preacher ask his cousins for an up-to-date copy of passports? And satisfy that the tours undertaken were from non LEF funds. (Offerings).
Can land /house details of property owned / gifted / money gifted / given be also similarly asked by the HQ, Will the HQ which has the biggest swindlers, will be paranoid on all except its relatives?
What is O.K. to someone may not be the same to another one! Is a correct statement, one man’s poison is another man’s meat, for a thief stealing is his normal day to day work, for a police man arresting a thief is a normal day to day work. There is something called as Law which says, thou shalt not steal, There is something called as the Bible which says , Anyone who has been stealing must steal no longer, but must work, doing something useful with their own hands, that they may have something to share with those in need.(Ephesians 4:28) (What a truly revolutionary idea). There is a Government rule on Trusts which says, elections must be held once in 5 years, who is not obeying the rules and why?
People who thunder from the pulpit “If you don’t have accounts you are a thief”, themselves won’t give accounts”. My statement is this, tell the truth, the LEF is a family trust which has only its family members to benefit, why call it a fellowship /church and also steal?
Let the people in Manipur ask the LEF to clear up its stand and then preach (by publishing in the newspapers), the Christian areas in Manipur don’t need such scam preachers. Let the people in AP also ask for clarifications before the great revival meetings shows begin
Anonymous@ May28th 11:58 p.m Well said brother/sister. but the problem is no one seems to worry about all that is written in this blog. I left LEF a few decades ago, but I have been reading this blog for some time now.I think the leaders by now would have struck a deal with the powers that may be and that is the reason nothing comes out . Otherwise how can an organisation of this magnituderun without proper accounting/reporting to the Govt. I read somewhere in the blog that the original LEF was dissolved and a new LEFI has been formed but not registered. simply unbelievable. Leaders? who thundered from the pulpits about corruption, restitution, returning the stolen money etc... etc....Won t they ask themselves the same question. ..... probably they may have to return the whole of the property to the faceless , innocent people of LEF to cleanse themselves of the rot inside. The poor are taken for granted, tossed about and exploited. How can they preach about oppression?
Delete'Whited sepulchres', as Jesus Himself described them; 'preaching' purity to others, whilst spiritually dead and putrefying inside themselves; the blind leading the blind, and all eventually falling into the ditch.
DeleteWho tie the bell to the cat?
DeleteGod has belled many a cat, there was a Strong male cat called Samson who thought that today will be like yesterday and lived as he pleased, his enemies blinded him, made him go bald and finally the ex strong man understood that God and keeping his commandments was his strength and cried to the Lord to strengthen him once more. In the final fight the Lamb of God will overcome the Dragon, so dont worry, just pray and all cats will tremble and fall flat when the Lion of Judah roars
DeleteI think the leaders by now would have struck a deal with the powers that may be and that is the reason nothing comes out . It is a true statement, but how were the deals struck, by supply of money, wine and women (either directly / Indirectly) from offering money, It is not smartness but a criminal act, God will see and judge and that to soon
ReplyDeleteLet some Good Samaritans, print the comments in this blog (atleast a few, after translating into Telugu), make some Photostat copies / print and distribute discretely in the revival meetings in AP and TS, to close friends and relatives, as seeds from which righteousness will grow and spread
ReplyDeleteJohn Daniel seems to have been lying very low in the face of the allegations and evidence against him and his family. Perhaps he is a little shy....... Or perhaps he is waiting for a more direct approach?
ReplyDeleteWait a minute, though...... here is a direct invitation that he has issued on his LinkedIn profile:
"Connect with me using john.daniel1@yahoo.com . All invitations to connect welcome. To brain storm and collaborate call me now at (248)-207-3375.'
Anyone feel like accepting his invitation and indulging in a little 'brain-storming' over LEF matters? If you ring, don't forget the USA code!
If you happen to be in his neighbourhood, you could call in. They live very simply because they are 'learning faith', but I expect they could manage a cup of tea....you might even be blessed with a performance by the Daniel Five.
Watch this space for the address.
OK: for visitors to the Daniel residence, the address is 7284 Angle Road, Northville, MI 48168 - 9464. It is quite spacious, 3415sq.ft., and sits in a 5 acre private lot, so you might have to search a bit. Apparently it was re-financed on 17 October 2012 via a deed of trust or mortgage. One wonders why, given that it is registered as LEFI premises (religious) - unless this has something to do with the fact that it is also registered as a manufacturing business and maybe the 'principal' and sole employee of that business (who could that be?) was running short of cash. It is worth about $445,000 at present, but even in 2013 the annual property tax was $3,288, and of course there would be house insurance in addition. Hate to think what the utilities might cost, what with all those girls having showers, busy on their laptops etc., and an eighty-year-old to be kept warm in Michigan winters. 3415 sq.ft. is quite a big space to heat....
DeleteThe house seems to be out of town, a bit remote. Wonder if the Daniel 5 and their 'missionary to India' mother need their own cars? And what about Grandma?
You might also want to visit the actual LEFI 'church', about a half hour drive away, if you are in the area. The Daniels will need to give you directions, as evidently they are the only people who attend it. Wonder when that's going to be re-financed? Perhaps it has been......
Bon voyage!
There must have been some big plans there. I've heard there are some "pigeon heads" that have settled in Novi. iNDIA WD. PROBABLY HAVE TO BE PLAYED DOWN.
ReplyDeleteIndian/South Asian population[edit]See also: History of the Asian Indians in Metro Detroit
The 2008 CNN/Money "Best Places to Live" stated that the city had a significant Asian Indian population.[14] According to the 2000 U.S. Census there were 1,278 ethnic Asian Indians in Novi.[31]
The 25,000-square-foot (2,300 m2) Sri Venkateswara Temple and Cultural Center (SVTCC), built for $10 million, opened in 2013. It is the first Michigan Hindu temple to be named after a southern Indian deity. It had a temporary location for five years before it opened its permanent facility. As of 2013 the temple has a client base of about 3,000 people. The community operating the temple mostly comes from the Indians who speak Telugu. Many of them originate from Andhra Pradesh.[
Committee mystery:
ReplyDeleteWho were the 'Friends of Birgit Daniel', a committee based in the LEFI premises at 7284 Angle Road, Northville, MI48168-9464 (a.k.a. The Daniel family residence, but presumably financed by Indian LEF attendees). Why was this mysterious committee, fronted by John Daniel's wife (a.k.a. 'The missionary to India'), dissolved on the same date that 7284 Angle Road was re-financed by mortgage or deed of trust?
'Curiouser and curiouser', as Alice in Wonderland put it........
Doesn't 're-finance' mean taking out some or most of the value of a property, and entering into a new agreement to pay it back over an extended period? If this property was bought using LEF tithes and offerings, what did The Daniel family do with the money they acquired from it in 2012?
How many other LEF properties have they been making use of in this way?
Surprise, surprise! Birgit Daniel ('missionary to India') was the treasurer of this mysterious committee which appears to have some kind of financial purpose or connection. To contact her one needed to email john7284@charter.net. Which 'John' would that be, then?
DeleteBridgett prove that you served poor people like other who gave their lices.Look at Franklin Graham. serving every where that calamily strikes. Instead in the name of ministry you all are just vacationing all over the world and doing business using poor peoples money and oppress Gods chldren . There is no one who can tell that you thousands and thousands whom you except used. It looks lije you all are in the place where God tells that HE them believe their lies , take pleasure in their wickedness and do not follow the truth as in 2 thessalonians 2:11 because of their hardened heart.That is why you are doing what you are doing and not able to answer . You have no truth to answer. Dont lead the innocent people to hell. There are lot who turned out to be like you all because that is all they learnt from you.
DeleteHow much the Daniels act in the US, The do know how to milk the LEF for money, and at the same time act as so simple honest hard working folks, Will they allow such refinancing in India (by non Daniels), soon it will happen in a hundred places. If a missionary opens and closes a mysterious committee, I feel it is not proper as the bible talks of openness. Jesus was never accused of such financial scams and so he was quiet. let JJD please explain the following or shut up.
ReplyDeleteDoesn't 're-finance' mean taking out some or most of the value of a property, and entering into a new agreement to pay it back over an extended period? If this property was bought using LEF tithes and offerings, what did The Daniel family do with the money they acquired from it in 2012?
How many other LEF properties have they been making use of in this way?
The Daniel family contains no genuine missionaries. 'Missionary to India' is allegedly how Birgit Daniel has referred to herself, according to a previous post.
DeleteTaking out a loan on the equity accrued on the home (Home equity loan) might be a way of milking money out of it- if this is possible in this particular situation-Eventually sell the home and close the loan (pay it off). Even if one in the end were to lose money, based on the selling price of said real estate, it would be someone else's money i.e. the LEFI. Only speculating.
ReplyDeleteTo refinance usually means for a fee to the bank they allow a lower interest rate and the option, then, of a new time framework in which to pay the loan off.
ReplyDeleteWhy might JJD have done this? If he paid for the house himself, we cannot object, but it is regd. as LEF premises as well as his business premises, and we know that it is his family home. The trouble with being secretive and even dishonest in the handling of other people's money is that everything else you do is cause for suspicion !
Delete'Oh what a tangled web we weave
When first we practise to deceive.......'
Any comment, John Daniel? No??? In all the best detective stories 'No comment' its the characteristic response of the villain to police questioning.....
John Daniel is on the Salem (Michigan, USA) Township Board of Trustees, and specifically a committee relating to land development(!). Is this an appropriate appointment for somebody allegedly mixed up in so much dubious activity relating to money and land/property purchase, apparently on an international scale?
DeleteShould this American organisation be apprised of this Whistleblowing exercise, and its findings?
John Daniel is on the committee relating to land development, this an appropriate appointment for somebody allegedly mixed up in so much dubious activity relating to money and land/property purchase, apparently on an international scale. He has cleverly avoided all information on his LEF links (while in India he boasts of such US links, as a sign of his mature contributions to the society). Definitely this American organisation needs to be apprised of this Whistleblowing exercise, and its findings. they will be surprised. mail to townboard@salem-mi.org, on the creative accounting skills of JJD and family and ask them to also call IRS (internal Revenue Service) for a discussion
ReplyDeleteJJD self portrait in Salem (Michigan, USA) Township Board of Trustees is very nice and all LEF people must read it an so it is reproduced here (see how much of his life is covered up, Is this fair, you decide).
John Daniel
Trustee
john@salem-mi.org
Born in Ft Wayne, IN, and having moved to Michigan, I have been a resident of Salem Township for the last 21 years, married to a wonderful wife, with 5 children (ages 18, 17, 15, 12 and 10).
During the past 25 years, I have worked for various companies like Eaton Corporation, Sumitomo Electric and Kennametal Inc in various functions in Engineering, Marketing, Sales and Business Management. Currently I work for BASF and I serve on the board of directors for a non-profit organization. (my question is this, what are the non-profit organizations) As an individual, I have always looked to help others and to see what one can do for the betterment of the community. I am a firm believer in the principle of “What we sow today, we will reap tomorrow”. (Remember no mention of General Motors where as per his dad (JD) he was a Vice President, which was told repeatedly in the retreats)
We can only trust that 'what is sewn today will be reaped tomorrow' proves to be true in his case and that of his implicated family members!
DeleteJohn-D is starting to look like an outright con artist.
DeleteThis explains some of the contradictions that cropped up in conversations with him long ago.
All John Daniel has to do to exonerate himself from 'inconvenient' allegations is to explain his finances and the ownership of properties in respect of tithes and offerings gained from LEF attenders/supporters.
ReplyDeleteThat he continues to remain silent about this, but instead instructs his henchmen to issue commands to close this blog, together with implied threats, and efforts to intimidate by the use of 'the police' (allegedly) in both the USA and India, speaks volumes about his personal integrity, and the ethos of the LEF.
Buddy, You... the owner of this blog ....
ReplyDeleteI say to you now, after you came to the LEF you are blessed, up then what's your life Buddy rewind you reel....... Don't harm your neighbour that will harm you. What you are saying was true, there's no sence in telling it to the world. God is there to take care of those people. Mr.__________, learn to love your enemy, It's the hardest part of the christian life. tc
Anonymous June 8, 7.11a.m.
DeleteJesus publicly exposed the Pharisees. He called them 'graves full of putrefying matter'. He publicly turned over the tables of the moneylenders in the temple. He spoke publicly and very plainly about their misdeeds. The apostle Paul and other New Testament writers exposed evil-doers within the visible church, often naming them as well as describing the nature and extent of their wickedness. Those letters were read out to many listeners.
I do not know what your true motive is, but your advice does not come from Scripture. You have completely misapplied a single verse taken out of context. The owners of this blog are running it because they do love both those who are being abused in LEF, and those who are doing the abusing. The abusers need to be urged to repent for the sake of their souls, whilst the abused need to be helped to escape from the abusers.
This is not a personal vendetta because an individual has been offended. It is a serious endeavour to stop the long-term abuse of people for whom Christ died.
If you are one of the abusers, then for your own soul's sake please repent. If you are one of the abused, sever your connections with LEF and the Daniel family, and do not try to deter those who are trying to help you.
June. 8. 7:11
ReplyDeleteYou ate wrong- this blog is blessing to many. See the news about Sathy and other evangelists. Remember the only time Jesus angry was against the business people in his temple and he called them thieves. LEF is worst than those thieves. There is no sin left that is not covered up in LEF for their business. What happened to all the forgiving godly people who sacrificed their lives to build LEF They are no more respected or sent out with lies. But more thieves brought in. This blog is like Joshua and Caleb against LEF. God bless them and use them to deliver many innocent victims from the curse of LEF team.
How big and effective was the demon casting ministry of Washington's they are trying to extend their ministry outside LEF using this title or is this another scam to loot innocent people
ReplyDeleteAny ministry majoring on 'casting out (alleged) demons' is likely to be a scam. Betty Daniel a.k.a Liz Van Vamp a.k.a Mrs. Lamdin currently appears to be majoring on the 'ministry' of well-known heretic and con-man T.B. Joshua. This demonstrates how spiritually dangerous Joshua Daniel's failure to teach Christian doctrine was. So many LEF people are still taken in by TV or popular ministries which are well-known to be fake e.g. Joyce Meyer, Benny Hinn, David Yonggi Cho. Joshua Daniel's own theological ignorance has left this sad legacy in addition to his legacy of intmidation, and dubious finances/property deals.
DeleteYes the decline of LEF is helping some of these opputunities to take advantage for their benefit.
DeleteAny ministry majoring on 'casting out (alleged) demons' is likely to be a scam. Betty Daniel a.k.a Liz Van Vamp a.k.a Mrs. Lamdin currently appears to be majoring on the 'ministry' of well-known heretic and con-man T.B. Joshua. This demonstrates how spiritually dangerous Joshua Daniel's failure to teach Christian doctrine was. So many LEF people are still taken in by TV or popular ministries which are well-known to be fake e.g. Joyce Meyer, Benny Hinn, David Yonggi Cho. Joshua Daniel's own theological ignorance has left this sad legacy in addition to his legacy of intmidation, and dubious finances/property deals.
DeleteWell said. I've noticed that she is a very high-strung individual. If she meets up with the real thing it could go very bad for her in addition to the erroneous teaching. Her dad would boast from the pulpit how he spent time at London Bible School (or college) but didn't really have to attend classes uch because he was seeing revival.
Too bad about that. It could have instructed and corrected him.
I am quite sure that Joshua Daniel never attended any substantive form of Bible training in London. Neither has there been any revival in England during what would have been the relevant time period. There may have been some loose connection with a little-known institution in Birkenhead (North of England). No reputable Bible training institution would permit an actual, or even potential, student to absent himself because of an alleged 'revival'. Nobody of any spiritual consequence in England, and certainly not in London, has ever heard of Joshua Daniel. A man as arrogant as he was in spiritual and other matters would never be accepted for formal training.
DeleteAnother of the 'My son John is Vice-chairman/principal/whatever of General Motors' kind of story (though there may some authenticity attached to the 'vice' bit!).
John Daniel continues to be a Trustee on the Board of Salem Township, as is evidenced in its Spring 2015 news letter. People are advised to contact this organisation and point out that there are serious and as yet unanswered questions about the Daniel family in connection with money and property apparently obtained, without any accountability, from tithes and offerings extracted from those who attend the Laymen's Evangelical Fellowship. Contact details are available online. Google John Daniel Salem Township Trustee.
ReplyDeleteHahaha Please note the last line.
DeleteJohn Daniel
Trustee
john@salem-mi.org
Born in Ft Wayne, IN, and having moved to Michigan, I have been a resident of Salem Township for the last 21 years, married to a wonderful wife, with 5 children (ages 18, 17, 15, 12 and 10).
During the past 25 years, I have worked for various companies like Eaton Corporation, Sumitomo Electric and Kennametal Inc in various functions in Engineering, Marketing, Sales and Business Management. Currently I work for BASF and I serve on the board of directors for a non-profit organization. As an individual, I have always looked to help others and to see what one can do for the betterment of the community. I am a firm believer in the principle of “What we sow today, we will reap tomorrow”.
If you wish to alert the Salem township committee about the questions surrounding John Daniel and family in respect of money, property etc., the person to email is Mr. Gary Whittaker. His email is:
Deletegary@salem-mi.org
Some letters have already been sent, together with references to this website and the Suniemi website. Please keep emails factual and to the point. The more emails he receives, the better.
It is not only LD. There are few other families with her planned and plotted. They what she wanted and did evrything including doing things behind senior Daniels and got rewarded no matter what they do everything against what LEF say they stand for in their oersonnal life.
ReplyDelete