This blog post is the consolidation of various comments of people who have known this corrupt family in close quarters in US. Examining the comments of these people on this blog helps people understand why Joshua Daniel and his family cut such a sorry figure in their "ministry" in USA. While many Indian-based churches have flourished and are growing in the USA in the recent past with more and more Indians finding their way to US, LEF was decimated and is reduced to empty pews in the Christ Community Church that JD (Joshua Daniel) and clan try to boast of as some kind of monumental victory. It was interesting that Lydia Daniel(LD) decided to post some pictures of some God forsaken Easter Retreat in the magazine, Christ Victor. Except the white looking John Daniel's family(with an exception of John Daniel himself), there may have been 3-4 other Caucasians in the picture. Looks like Lydia Daniel and John Daniel have finally realized that Indians working in US have steady income in the US and it may be in the Daniels' best interest to lure Indians to US retreats to have steady source of income as the money reserves in LEF as we hear are depleting at an exponential rate. Joshua Daniel when alive and also John Daniel were known to put subtle pressure on parents whose children work in USA to have their children send their tithes to John Daniel and the clan (who from the inception of LEF have acted like parasites to eat the money from LEF non-profit). Not many would have succumbed to this pressure, but there are always some weaker ones who will fall prey into the hands of this Daniel family predators just like some American youth who for some period of time were under the evil grip of the conman, Joshua Daniel and his son John Daniel.
Here are the comments that throw a lot of light:
Comment 1: Yes, it is true Joshua's children never went to the Bible College. 3 of us who come from much poor backgrounds from my city Valparaiso, we went to India. We always went in winter time and Johnny was at Notre Dame @ the time, so he never went. Betty had already run away to marry Brian. This is what caused me to drop out of Fellowship. John was driving a Benz going to Notre Dame. Joshus Daniel's house was never in order as his daughter ran away, yet Lily applied such a hypocritical high standard for me. I was expected to drive them around and be their slave. It was very bad. We were expected to sacrifice everything but John could go to Notre Dame and not sacrifice any thing at all. They wanted him to be in charge even though he could not preach very well. Brother Whitson was a great person. I enjoyed the Bible school even though it was a bit strange and small. Brother Whitson knew the Bible very well. It was a bit anti-Pentecostal though, the Pentecostal were anti repentance so the whole situation was devastating for me. I publicly called Joshua Daniel a hypocrite at a retreat. I read Matthew 23 at Joshua Daniel and John Daniel during prayer at a retreat. I was actually pushed out of the door and told never to come back after I was swindled out of large sum of money (4 trips to India, driving everyone around constantly, etc...). Nobody cared. Nobody called.We made amends after his heartache but he never apologized or repented of anything. I emailed the headquarters a million times before he died, it is waste of time.
When Betty was allowed back in without repentance it was too much, they kept saying I was the reason there was no revival and other totally wicked things about me.
Joshua Daniel made some money on his own when he preached in American churches. LEF did not pay for everything. But Notre Dame is quite expensive, so is Valparaiso University, Bethel college was not very good, Betty attended there when she ran away from home to marry Brian in some lame effort to hurt her father. Well I guess it worked but who marries some one to punish their father?
Comment 2: Nobody cared, it was devastating, only after his first heart attack some LEF member called and asked me to pray for him. It was hard not to hang up the phone on them. I had to drive to South Bend to get my Bible back, it was very bad. I was pushed out the door in-front of everyone. The service just went on like nothing happened. His mother remained friendly with me. She wasn't there but I am sure she knew about it, along with his sister. They were worried about Johnny even back then.
Comment 3: I knew the Daniels before Betty ran away, their decline was gradual. The first meetings I went to @ the Sutton's house were very good. There was real conviction present but things gradually declined. It is hard to live christian life in USA it is very different than India. Joshua was a true prophet at one time, like Balaam who was true prophet as well.
Comment 4: All left except Mrs.Martin and some people from India. No American is going to be their slave, caste system is not acceptable here. I think only Indians on H1b visa will go to their church for any length of time.
Comment 5: I don't think their moves to Michigan were related to what was or was not going on.
John and Joseph landed jobs in Detroit in the 90s. I think the others moved there because there was no one coming to their South Bend meetings. Lydia was the only kid at home and they had lots of grandchildren in Detroit. Also, they thought they could help John's fledgling efforts there.
Gary's memories of Joshua Daniel's kids match mine. No matter what Joshua Daniel may have preached about holding his children to higher standards than others, that was not what people witnessed. The double-standards were ridiculously glaring. Joshua Daniel expected that his children would be a great help to his ministry, but John was the only one who jumped in with both feet. One of the German leaders told me, even when she was still 100% in the LEF, that Joshua Daniel's weakness was his children. A part of the reason the German LEF severed its ties to the Daniels was because they explicitly said that they would not have John Daniel as their leader. Regarding the "hardheartedness" of North America, I think this was the only rationalization they could come up with for their lack of converts. There are so many stories about John Daniel alienating people in Detroit, but it was usually turned around as a THAT person's problem. People see what they want to see.
Comment 6: I brought 3 people to Valpo meeting, one left after he got married to a woman they did not approve of, the other left after he went to college, I left after I was offended by their hypocrisy, after Betty ran away, what was there to sell, Joshua Daniel's house was not in order, according to the Bible he was not fit to be elder, Joseph and James always had problems as well, I think Joseph noticed something was wrong, James I don't know. It was easy to tell something was wrong, it will never grow in USA, only H1b visa people will go , it got much worse over time. John Daniel drove a Benz, it was very offensive, they tried but no sane person would support their ministry after one got to know them. Yes they used LEF funds to send their kids to most expensive schools while driving Benz, what can one do about it now, nothing. They tried to build a following but they became so evil over time.
Comment 7: The LEF money went to Notre Dame and Valparaiso University, and to their nice 350K house in south bend, they did try to build a following though but they mistreated me so bad I left, others notice it was unstable, At times Joshua Daniel spoke so wonderfully it was confusing, he could preach like a angel then act like the devil afterwords. He tried to force us to sign a document saying Joseph would return to India, we refused, we knew Joseph wanted money and would never leave USA. Joseph was honest but mainly he was driven by money. John was always driven by ecclesiastical clout (using religion to dominate from the love of self like the catholic church.)
Comment 8:Joshua Daniel and John Daniel were truly evil. He wanted me to drive him around all the time even though he was wealthy and I was a poor factory worker, I must have drove him to Chicago 15 times, he never once offered to pay for gas, he used to pray at me that I was hindrance to revival, which was really stupid as I was the only one that brought any one. Eventually I publicly called them hypocrites, they then attacked me pushed me out the door and told me never come back. I never even got a chance to get my Bible. I was in shock, I had made 4 trips to India. No he is a evil person, Lily is the same: one set of rules for them another for everyone else, John was driving a Benz before he got out of Notre Dame, why couldn’t he drive his dad around? I drove them to Oklahoma once, Lily had the nerve to preach about how playing Bible tapes in the car was wrong, she could have at least paid for gas instead of being hyper critically self righteous. What kind of person complains from the pulpit about Bible tapes, they blasphemed tongues all the time. Implied they had done great things for God while I had not, how would they know. She told me I did not meet the qualifications of an elder: however neither does she as her house was never in order. Betty ran away to marry someone that her Dad hated to get back at him.
Here are the comments that throw a lot of light:
Comment 1: Yes, it is true Joshua's children never went to the Bible College. 3 of us who come from much poor backgrounds from my city Valparaiso, we went to India. We always went in winter time and Johnny was at Notre Dame @ the time, so he never went. Betty had already run away to marry Brian. This is what caused me to drop out of Fellowship. John was driving a Benz going to Notre Dame. Joshus Daniel's house was never in order as his daughter ran away, yet Lily applied such a hypocritical high standard for me. I was expected to drive them around and be their slave. It was very bad. We were expected to sacrifice everything but John could go to Notre Dame and not sacrifice any thing at all. They wanted him to be in charge even though he could not preach very well. Brother Whitson was a great person. I enjoyed the Bible school even though it was a bit strange and small. Brother Whitson knew the Bible very well. It was a bit anti-Pentecostal though, the Pentecostal were anti repentance so the whole situation was devastating for me. I publicly called Joshua Daniel a hypocrite at a retreat. I read Matthew 23 at Joshua Daniel and John Daniel during prayer at a retreat. I was actually pushed out of the door and told never to come back after I was swindled out of large sum of money (4 trips to India, driving everyone around constantly, etc...). Nobody cared. Nobody called.We made amends after his heartache but he never apologized or repented of anything. I emailed the headquarters a million times before he died, it is waste of time.
When Betty was allowed back in without repentance it was too much, they kept saying I was the reason there was no revival and other totally wicked things about me.
Joshua Daniel made some money on his own when he preached in American churches. LEF did not pay for everything. But Notre Dame is quite expensive, so is Valparaiso University, Bethel college was not very good, Betty attended there when she ran away from home to marry Brian in some lame effort to hurt her father. Well I guess it worked but who marries some one to punish their father?
Comment 2: Nobody cared, it was devastating, only after his first heart attack some LEF member called and asked me to pray for him. It was hard not to hang up the phone on them. I had to drive to South Bend to get my Bible back, it was very bad. I was pushed out the door in-front of everyone. The service just went on like nothing happened. His mother remained friendly with me. She wasn't there but I am sure she knew about it, along with his sister. They were worried about Johnny even back then.
Comment 3: I knew the Daniels before Betty ran away, their decline was gradual. The first meetings I went to @ the Sutton's house were very good. There was real conviction present but things gradually declined. It is hard to live christian life in USA it is very different than India. Joshua was a true prophet at one time, like Balaam who was true prophet as well.
Comment 4: All left except Mrs.Martin and some people from India. No American is going to be their slave, caste system is not acceptable here. I think only Indians on H1b visa will go to their church for any length of time.
Comment 5: I don't think their moves to Michigan were related to what was or was not going on.
John and Joseph landed jobs in Detroit in the 90s. I think the others moved there because there was no one coming to their South Bend meetings. Lydia was the only kid at home and they had lots of grandchildren in Detroit. Also, they thought they could help John's fledgling efforts there.
Gary's memories of Joshua Daniel's kids match mine. No matter what Joshua Daniel may have preached about holding his children to higher standards than others, that was not what people witnessed. The double-standards were ridiculously glaring. Joshua Daniel expected that his children would be a great help to his ministry, but John was the only one who jumped in with both feet. One of the German leaders told me, even when she was still 100% in the LEF, that Joshua Daniel's weakness was his children. A part of the reason the German LEF severed its ties to the Daniels was because they explicitly said that they would not have John Daniel as their leader. Regarding the "hardheartedness" of North America, I think this was the only rationalization they could come up with for their lack of converts. There are so many stories about John Daniel alienating people in Detroit, but it was usually turned around as a THAT person's problem. People see what they want to see.
Comment 6: I brought 3 people to Valpo meeting, one left after he got married to a woman they did not approve of, the other left after he went to college, I left after I was offended by their hypocrisy, after Betty ran away, what was there to sell, Joshua Daniel's house was not in order, according to the Bible he was not fit to be elder, Joseph and James always had problems as well, I think Joseph noticed something was wrong, James I don't know. It was easy to tell something was wrong, it will never grow in USA, only H1b visa people will go , it got much worse over time. John Daniel drove a Benz, it was very offensive, they tried but no sane person would support their ministry after one got to know them. Yes they used LEF funds to send their kids to most expensive schools while driving Benz, what can one do about it now, nothing. They tried to build a following but they became so evil over time.
Comment 7: The LEF money went to Notre Dame and Valparaiso University, and to their nice 350K house in south bend, they did try to build a following though but they mistreated me so bad I left, others notice it was unstable, At times Joshua Daniel spoke so wonderfully it was confusing, he could preach like a angel then act like the devil afterwords. He tried to force us to sign a document saying Joseph would return to India, we refused, we knew Joseph wanted money and would never leave USA. Joseph was honest but mainly he was driven by money. John was always driven by ecclesiastical clout (using religion to dominate from the love of self like the catholic church.)
Comment 8:Joshua Daniel and John Daniel were truly evil. He wanted me to drive him around all the time even though he was wealthy and I was a poor factory worker, I must have drove him to Chicago 15 times, he never once offered to pay for gas, he used to pray at me that I was hindrance to revival, which was really stupid as I was the only one that brought any one. Eventually I publicly called them hypocrites, they then attacked me pushed me out the door and told me never come back. I never even got a chance to get my Bible. I was in shock, I had made 4 trips to India. No he is a evil person, Lily is the same: one set of rules for them another for everyone else, John was driving a Benz before he got out of Notre Dame, why couldn’t he drive his dad around? I drove them to Oklahoma once, Lily had the nerve to preach about how playing Bible tapes in the car was wrong, she could have at least paid for gas instead of being hyper critically self righteous. What kind of person complains from the pulpit about Bible tapes, they blasphemed tongues all the time. Implied they had done great things for God while I had not, how would they know. She told me I did not meet the qualifications of an elder: however neither does she as her house was never in order. Betty ran away to marry someone that her Dad hated to get back at him.
